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September 2006
Elsewhere on the WebVictor Davis Hanson’s Private Papers Victor Davis Hanson Archive on National Review OnlineTour Books
A War Like No Other How the Athenians and Spartans Fought the Peloponnesian War
by Victor Hanson
Amazon.com’s Best of 2001 Many theories have been offered regarding why Western culture has spread so successfully across the world, with arguments ranging from genetics to superior technology to the creation of enlightened economic, moral, and political systems. In Carnage and Culture, military historian Victor Hanson takes all of these factors into account in making a bold, and sure to be controversial, argument: Westerners are more effective killers.
by Victor Davis Hanson
by Victor Davis Hanson
by Victor Davis Hanson
by Victor Davis Hanson, John Keegan Hanson, for those who somehow have missed him until now, is a professor of Classics at California State and also is a part time farmer, both of which have contributed to his writing as a military historian. As a classicist, Hanson is well versed in the sources in their original Greek, and as a farmer he understands how agriculture affected the experience of the Greeks at war.
by Victor Davis Hanson
by Victor Davis Hanson
Hanson relates the life stories of his farmer neighbors, writing that their way of life will likely soon disappear, thanks in part to a federal system of agricultural subsidies that favors large-scale, industrial farm corporations over individual “yeomen.” This is a sobering and eye-opening book. by Victor Davis Hanson On first glance, The Soul of Battle appears to be three different books: biographies of two well-known generals—Sherman and Patton—and one who is virtually unknown today, the ancient Greek leader Epaminondas. Yet Victor Davis Hanson, a classics professor and author of The Western Way of War, makes a compelling connection between these three men. They were “eccentrics, considered unbalanced or worse by their own superiors” who led democratic armies on missions of freedom.
by Robert B. Strassler (Editor), Victor Davis Hanson (Introduction)
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September 16, 2006 6:37 PM
Depressing TimesOriana Fallaci, RIP, the Pope, and a Sad Age Rarely has the death of a public intellectual affected me as much as the passing of Oriana Fallaci. I never met her, and only received a brief note once from her accompanying a copy of The Rage and the Pride. The story of her career is well known, but her death, at this pivotal time, was full of paradoxes and yet instruction as well. Radical Islam is, among other things, a patriarchal movement, embedded particularly in the cult of the Middle-Eastern male, who occupies a privileged position in a society that can be fairly described as one of abject gender apartheid. Islamism is also at war with the religious infidel, not just the atheist—and, in its envy and victimhood, fueled by a renewal of the age-old hatred of the Christian. But so far, with very few exceptions other than the lion, Christopher Hitchens, the courageous William Shawcross, and a few others, the Left has either been neutral or anti-American in this struggle. And few Christians in positions of influence and respect have publicly defended their faith and the civilization that birthed it. Candor, after all, can get one killed, exiled, or ostracized—whether a Danish cartoonist, a Dutch filmmaker, a Wall Street Journal reporter, or a British-Indian novelist. So here, ill and in her seventies, returned Ms. Fallaci one last time to take up the hammer and tongs against radical Islam—a diminutive woman of the Left and self-proclaimed atheist who wrote more bravely on behalf of her civilization than have most who are hale, males, conservatives, or Christians. Her fiery message was as timely as it was caricatured and slandered: Muslims who leave the Middle East to live under the free aegis of the West have a moral duty to support and protect the civilization that has welcomed them, rather than romanticize about what they have forsaken; Christianity is more than a religion, but also a powerful emblem of the force of reason, in that it seeks to spread belief by rational thought as well as faith; and that affluent and leisured Westerners, bargaining away their honor and traditions out of fear and for illusory security, have only emboldened radical Islam that seeks to liquidate them. I wish she were still alive to scoff at the politically correct, the appeaser, and the triangulator, but alas she is gone, defiant to the last. And what are we to make of poor Benedict XVI, the scholastic, who, in a disastrous display of public sensitivity, makes the telling point, that Christianity, in its long evolution to the present, has learned to forsake violence, and to defend its faith through appeals to reason—and thus can offer its own experience in the current crisis of Islam. And by quoting from the emperor rhetorician Manuel Paleologus—whose desperate efforts at strengthening the Morea and the Isthmus at Corinth a generation before that awful Tuesday, May 29, 1453 all came to naught—the Pope failed to grasp that under the tenets of radical Islam of the modern age, context means little, intent nothing, learning less than zero. If a sentence, indeed a mere phrase can be taken out of context, twisted, manipulated to show an absence of deference to Islam, furor ensues, death threats follow, assassins load their belts—even as the New York Times or the Guardian issues its sanctimonious apologies in the hope that the crocodile will eat them last. We learned the now familiar rage with the Danish cartoons, Theo Van Gogh, the false flushed Koran story, the forced change of “Operation Infinite Justice” to “Enduring Freedom”, the constant charges of “Islamaphobia”, and a horde of other false grievances that so shook the West, traumatized in fear of having its skyscrapers, planes, trains, buses, nightclubs, and synagogues blown apart or its oil cut off. So, yes, we know the asymmetrical rules: a state run-paper in Cairo or the West Bank, a lunatic Iranian mullah, a grand mufti from this or that mosque, can all rail about infidels, “pigs and apes”, in language reminiscent of the Third Reich—and meet with approval in the Middle East and silence in the West. But for a Westerner, a Tony Blair, George Bush, or Pope Benedict to even hint that something has gone terribly wrong with modern Islam, is to endure immediate furor and worse. In short, no modern ideology, no religious sect of the present age demands so much of others, so little of itself. In matters of the present war, I have given up on most of the neoconservatives, many of whom, following the perceived pulse of the battlefield, have either renounced their decade-long, pre-September11 rants to remove Saddam (despite the 140,000 brave souls still on the field of battle who took them at their word), or turned on the President on grounds that he is not waging the perfect fight and thus is not pursuing the good war. The Paleo-right is as frightening as is the lunatic Left. My old Democratic party is long dead, their jackals trying to tear apart the solitary and stumbling noble stag Joe Liebermann, the old center taken over by the Kerry and Soros billionaires, and the guilt-ridden academic, celebrity and media cadres. So we really are left with very little in these pivotal times—the will of George Bush, of course, the Old Breed unchanged since Okinawa and the Bulge that still anchors the US military, the courage and skill of a very few brave writers like a Hitchens, Krauthammer, and the tireless and brilliant Mark Steyn, but very, very few others. No, this is an age in which we in the West make smug snuff movies about killing an American President, while the Taliban and the Islamists boast of assassinating the Pope. So long may you run, Ms. Fallaci, you who by now have learned that, yes, there is a soul, and, yes, yours was indeed saved for eternity if only for its singular courage and honesty alone. And dear Pope: clarify, contextualize, express sorrow over the wrong interpretation of your remarks, but please don’t apologize for the Truth—not now, not ever. Comments (63)boinkie :rich :Well said! Your name should be added to that short list. Thanks for your writing and thanks for your courage. Paul H. :"...the courage and skill of a very few brave writers like a Hitchens, Krauthammer, and the tireless and brilliant Mark Stein..." I think you meant Mark Steyn, "Steynonline", www.marksteyn.com; (just to save search time for interested readers).
Liana :Thank you for remembering Ms. Fallaci so kindly. I'm so sad at her passing. Truly one of a kind, so brilliant, articulate, courageous. Where are all the men, that should be carrying the same cause? Let us not forget her passionate writings, her books should be required reading in our schools. I also agree and hope that the Pope does not apologise. The reaction in the Muslim streets speaks for itself, religion of peace? God help us... John in Cincinnati :Great post, sir! I haven't read Fallaci's books, but I've read about them and her, and I was sorry she was prosecuted in her native land and sorry to see her go. I am glad to see you priase to favorite authors of mine, Christopher Hitchens and Mark Steyn (not Stein). Reading Steyn this last month makes it tempting to move to Australia! Manny C :VDH, I believe one spells Mark's surname as Steyn and not Stein. MEC2 :Hear, hear! Fallaci's career showed one certain, infallabile trait she possessed - the ability to see past the camoflauge of her subjects to see them clearly as they were. Her views on the rise of Islamic Nationalism showed she maintained that keen insight until her last days. She, and Hitchens, and dare I say Bush and one VDH, among others, are the avant-garde - not the polluted term we use in the West to describe the cutting edge of nihlistic cultural advance into the abyss. No, the true avant-garde, those who have scouted the terrain ahead and seen the enemy up close. They warn us, those who follow - yet will we listen? Allen Moore :Sir, Once again you have hit the nail on its proverbial head. It seems that many in the West think that if they ignore the Islamic Fascists, they will disappear. I fear that the West will eventually learn the truth but it will be through an ever more painful awakening. I know you must grow tired but don't ever give up. Your words do matter. Thanks and keep the faith. GM Roper :Wow! It seems obvious that though you didn't meet her, her spirit and truths are alive and well and will continue in your writing. Thanks for the illuminating essay. Steven Malynn :Thank you Professor Hanson. It is truly frightening to see real scholars shunned by academia, and the self-professed "left" take sides with a fantasy of Arabia and Islam that exists only in their politically correct multi-cultural "reality-based" world. gs :"...poor Benedict XVI, the scholastic, who, in a disastrous display of public sensitivity...failed to grasp that under the tenets of radical Islam of the modern age, context means little, intent nothing, learning less than zero." Maybe the pope is not playing the media's game or an Islamic game, but is pursuing his own strategy. The times may be such that a centered magisterial Western voice impinges discordantly on our sensibilities. Ratzinger deserves support and the benefit of the doubt and I'm giving them to him until he demonstrates that he doesn't deserve them. Time will tell. A Blue Star Mom :What words need be added to this great essay? None, but "thank you VDH." We are in depressing times as the West slowly converts to Islam. Though not as dramatically as Centanni's and Wiig's conversion, inch by inch, terror of Islamic rage or even of offending Muslims has changed us. So, in England a public worker has to throw out a box of tissues printed with Piglet because it will offend Muslim senstivities. In New Jersey, Six Flags hosts a "Great Adventure Day" for Muslims...infidels are not invited to the park. Papers such as the NYT's will chide the Pope for reading a medievel quote and inciting violence while forgetting that one of its freelance correspondents - Steven Vincent - was killed by Islamic radicals two days after printing an article of his critical of the situation in Basrah, Iraq. It is all very depressing, indeed, but not without hope. Christians, in particular, study and recreate the story every Spring of initial hope, breaking of bread, promises of steadfast support, betrayal and then death. We are now living this story on a global scale. So, as the neo-cons lose their nerve, and the party of "social justice" calculates their next political move, we inch toward a descent into our own hellish visit to Islamic radicalism. For those of us who were raised in a Christian faith, we have learned, however, that the trip to Hell is not the end of the story. Sissy Willis :I agree with all you say except when you sigh that there are "very, very few" other than George Bush & Company, the military, a few brave writers and -- God willing -- Pope Benedict XVI who refuse to apologize for the Truth. Don't underestimate the power of the bloggers, "cognitive dissidents" who are well informed, think for themselves and aren't unafraid to speak their minds. Glenn Reynolds's Army of Davids is on the march. PierreLegrand :Perhaps the most powerful and apt eulogy of Ms. Fallaci. Thank you Dr. Hanson! Ralph Webb :I think you meant Mark Steyn, not Mark Stein. Grantman :Thank you, Victor, for a wonderful rememberance of a great, great lady. She will be missed, especially in the near future when her honesty and strength will be needed more than ever. Ed Minchau :Amen. Jim Dick :Bravo!!!! Know you specialize in ancient history but have you ever found a period in American History that is so bereft of public figures willing to stand up and defend their country. If you were an enemy - real or potential - and all you saw on your TV screen were figures like Harry Reid, Chuck Schumer, Durbin, Murtha, etc. would you not feel certain of a favorable outcome from any war that would ensue from your actions against America. If the Pope apologizes to the Umma, book to Australia where there appears to be some men of convictions left in public office. Jim Dick G.S. Cox :These are the times that try men's souls, sayeth the prophet, and we must never forget that there are forces at work we cannot see. The Western Tradition has met and matched many a terrible day, and night. Fred :Sir, I have to agree with the tenor of your comments that the number of writers and intellectuals displaying reason and clarity of thought is slowly shrinking. The loss of Ms. Fallaci is particularly painful. Her insight, coupled with indomitable courage served as an inspiration these past few years. In my own life, there are perhaps three, maybe four people, with whom I can engage in rationale discussion related to the day’s events. Most people I meet seem to ignore the threats we face, or worse, engage in wild conspiracy theories, societal self-loathing, and attacks on those attempting to preserve our western civilization. The growing darkness of world events is only exceeded by the growing darkness in the western mind. Ms. Fallaci was a light against this darkness, and will be missed. ForNow :The running is to be done by us, even to the skirl of the pipes. Departed historians famous and obscure who grasped the military factor in social change -- they have now greeted her. Brave journalists Michael Kelly and Thomas Paine, likewise no few of the very Signers, have welcomed her Home. For such as her, even the Valhallans have stood, Rick Rescorla stood up and was not alone. The Marathon is run again, and by us too, such as we variously are -- never say die -- and the news is borne of another lover and fighter for freedom, Oriana, gone to her reward and honor. Mike Antonucci :Bravo. I find it most ironic that Manuel II spent much of his reign trying to rouse the Pope and the European powers to aid him against the Ottoman Turks -- a plea they mostly ignored, only to find those same armies besieging European cities years later. The news reports correctly refer to Manuel as a Christian emperor, but have no space or inclination to note that Catholicism and Orthodoxy have been at odds for centuries. It adds to the irony that Manuel and the other latter Byzantine emperors were willing to place the Orthodox Church under the Pope's jurisdiction in order to secure military aid against the Turks. Even that desperate and unpopular measure failed. It seems to me that the failure of Western will is a story as old as the dialogue of Manuel II. Ken McCracken :VDH, You guys aren't as alone as you think you are. There are thousands of us online railing against an effete West in the face of radical Islam - but we just don't have the prominence or talent of a Hitchens, Krauthammer or a Steyn. But we eat their words up because they say what we wish we could. It is most distressing however that the left, for all its professed anger against misogyny, religious compulsion, fundamentalism and patriarchy, has backed out of this fight, or has actively gone over to the other side. Is there anyone on the left except Hitchens who thinks that, maybe, just maybe, bin Laden, Nasrullah and Ahmadinejad are bigger threats to the West than Bush and Blair? Michael Kennedy :Good column but Mark Steyn's name is misspelled. I am reading George Orwell's work, especially Homage to Catalonia. We need him more than ever right now. Another man of the left more to the point than most and current in spite of his death decades ago. Juan :I am confused - I hear endlessly from the paleo-conservatives of the mindless support of the neo- conservatives for President Bush; now I hear from a trusted source, VDH, that they have abandonded the President and the war; What is the evidence for this, and when did it take place? Joe :". . . or turned on the President on grounds that he is not waging the perfect fight and thus is not pursuing the good war." Am I correct in assuming this is criticism at Andrew Sullivan and others that supported the Iraq effort but now seem more concerned with seeing Bush, Cheney and Rumsfeld brought up on war crimes for waterboarding senior al Qaeda members? I don't think it is that simple. While much of the attacks are over the top, President Bush needs fair critcism or he might continue down the wrong path and lose this war. Complaining about indadequate troop levels or a lack of post war planning is legitimate and a reassessment and refocusing of our efforts is sorely needed to win. I remember someone saying that the strength of democracies in war was the more efficient dissemination of objective information. reliapundit :Well said. God Bless Her Soul - and you for your thoughtful commoration, and all yur other forthright writing. OPEN QUESTION: Fallaci also saw the light on Israel, and moved from anti-Zionist to Zionist. What do you think accounts for the fact that Hitchens has not, yet? How can he remain a foe of Israel - expecially in the light of fauxtography, al Dura, Jeningrad, Arafat's billions, (and so on and so forth etc.)? By refusing to see Israel's struggle as part of the West's struggle against Jihad, Hitchens proves he is at best still an irrational leftist at heart, and perhaps - dare I say it - an anti-Semite/self-hating Jew. The best explanation is that his continuing anti-Israel stance is the last vestige of his committment Leftism/socialism: socialists have long held that Israel was merely an outpost of Western hegemony, a colony. Which is false. As you know, the Middle East - Israel specifically - is the cradle of Western Civilization. A cradle stolen by Jihad via - well via the same schtick we see in the headlines today. Islam is as Islam ever was. Fallaci came to see this, and see that the West was indeed threatened - that Paris could go the way of Constantinople. Either by the quiet Jihad of colonization posing as immigration, or by intimidation and dhimmitude through Jihad. Paris might very well become Paristanbul in our lifetimes. We need 1000 new Fallaci's to come to the fore - or we will lose. KEEP FIGHTING, BABY! Heroic Dreamer :Thank you Professor Hanson for such lucid article and a fitting goodbye to Oriana Fallaci,a courageous hero. May she rest in peace. As your make you list, don't forget Wafa Sultan, Bridgette Gabriel, Ali Hirsi - and other rare and courageous Middle Easterners (they all seem to be women) standing up to islamic totalitarianism, speaking their minds. And,of course, include yourself. Many thanks for your writing which helps me to sort out these troubled times and gives me a little hope that we will prevail. danny :I also have given up on the neo-conservatives, they of very little backbone. William Kristol in particular has disgusted me with his distancing from the hard work required in Iraq. His ability to call for more conflict against Iran yet he fumes about how bungled the current hard work is. Monday-morning quarterbacking from his easy chair with very little to provide except more troops to do the "easy" job he had predicted. Wonderful piece VDH. Hello :There is nothing depressing about her passing. Oriana Fallaci was 77 years old. If the defense of the west depends on the writings of a 77 year old cancer patient, then there is no hope for western civilization. Perhaps Mr. Hanson is depressed because he has finally figured out what Ive been telling him in emails. Western Civ will lose this war and worldwide Islam will prevail. 1000s of years of darkenss lie ahead. All that is happening around us. This is what it is like to live in a dying civilization. Gareth :Mr. Hanson: A great post, but, with respect, I read the Pope's speech (not delivered) online and I suspect his point is far subtler; namely, that God is discovered through reason, not through faith alone, and he was quoting Paleologus, not passing judgement on Islam. I'm not sure he was insensitive on this particular occasion. Cheers, g rich :One of the real issues is the treatment of women. You recently wrote an essay on Saudi Arabian student visas. Do we set a quota that each male student visa should be matched by a female student visa? Or would that be confrontational? David Butz :A brilliant piece, but too depressing. We are winning, as VDH's other columns demonstrate. As the weak-kneed make their way to the exits, those who remain must remain steadfast and OPTIMISTIC, and with good cause; if only because our President will not fail us. I think VDH is tired. He needs simply to get a good night's sleep and resolve to come back to the battle refreshed. There is no other option. Our foes are trying to wait Bush out. But realistically, it would take nearly 3 years to effect a major change in policy, even if Bush's successor goes completely limp. For them that is a long and dangerous wait. The fact that this is their best course of action reveals how close to defeat they are. ajacksonian :Thank you, Mr. Hanson! Well and truly said and we should not fear speaking our minds and having our say as is our right in this world and not be damned for insensitivity when addressing it. There are consequences to defeat, and you have more supporters than you know to keep civilization going. There is honor in the fighting and in helping one caught under the boot of tyranny up to stand on their own. Some have not forgotten that. Helmut Steinwender :It all boils down to, can we rid ourselves of the socialist-radicalist cancer in time? When Hitler's Germany was defeated, Nazism became marginalized. The same never happened to Marxism, it has morphed, metastasized, hides under different labels, from radical environmentalism to feminism to multiculturalism. It eats away at our culture unpunished. Davis :The Paleologus quote was quite unnecessary to his argument, and I am coming around to the suspicion that he was being deliberately provocative. He is not a political naïf but has been for decades hip-deep in controversy. This is der Panzerkardinale. Might it be that this is not only to call the muslims to account for jihad but a challenge to multiculturalists that all religion is not the same, as well as to those who would marginalize religion in the world: “A reason which is deaf to the devine and which relegates religion into the realm of subcultures is incapable of entering into the dialogue of cultures.” We may yet live in interesting times. We should just not expect to hear about it in the news. Ragnell :Mr. Hanson The Pope may have had another purpose in focusing attention on the Byzantine Empire. As you know, it was a highly cultured, Christian- Roman civilization that pre-existed in the areas conquered by the Islamic Empires that replaced it. Has Benedict deliberately raised the West's consideration of historic evidence that contradicts several modern Islamic claims and victimology? For example, that Islam has a legal and historical claim to enforce its religious control over certain regions. The Byzantine emperor expressed fear and abhorrence of Islamic violence for valid historical reasons. He was not an ignorant, irrational bigot. His civilization was under brutal assault by the Islamic armies. Yet, I find few people know or remember the significant details of Byzantine's existence and final bloody ending. Islamic leaders have a tradition of ignoring the prior claims of other religions and civilizations that pre-existed Islamic dominance. Part of the Imams' anger may have also been provoked by their consternation that Byzantine's long buried historical lesson has been brought to world attention. Islam Attempts to Silence an Historic Warning Tantor :Professor Hanson, I share your grief over the passing of Ms. Fallaci but not your pessimism over America's will to win the war against Islamic fascism. I'll admit the softening will of the pundits is distressing but I also see a recognition by ordinary Americans of the implacable and unreasonable nature of the Islamic radicals and a growing sense that we are in an existential fight with them that we must win. Although it seems like America is snoozing through the threat right now, when the provocations reach a certain threshhold, America will switch into a war mode in a heartbeat. I'm sure that those passengers on Flight 93 would have taken pains not to offend Muslim sensibilities on Sep 10, but when the threat presented itself on Sep 11, they recognized the situation, mobilized, and fought to the death. That could have been any airliner flying over America that day, ordinary people who have the right stuff of heroes in extraordinary situations. They're everywhere. Don't sell America short, Professor Hanson. Not just yet. Tantor Carolyn McLaughlin :We're out here with you, Victor, seekers of the Truth; we don't expect to be universally loved. In these darkening days of defeatist pseudo-leaders and delusional intellectuals, it is sad to loose a single clearsighted intellectual, Oriana, and to have a real leader, Benedict, viified and abandoned for speaking the truth. But the role of Prophets was truth telling and not to be loved. Pamela :I do not for one moment believe this was a mere "slip of the tongue." Fallaci was unabashed in her admiration of Pope Benedict. On August 27, 2005, Fallaci had a private audience with Pope Benedict XVI at Castel Gandolfo with whom she found a kindred spirit and whom she believed understood the mortal threat faced by Christianity by Radical Islam The Pope loves her work. "I feel less alone when I read the books of Ratzinger." I had asked Ms. Fallaci whether there was any contemporary leader she admired, and Pope Benedict XVI was evidently a man in whom she reposed some trust. "I am an atheist, and if an atheist and a pope think the same things, there must be something true. It's that simple! There must be some human truth here that is beyond religion." That said, it is a poetic violence that this Muslim outrage should occur upon her death as a result of a Papal speech. Who knows, Perhaps Bush and Pope Benedict will join forces to fight the evil of militant Islam much the same way Reagan and Pope John Paul fought Soviet communism DaSarge :I commend to you the latest by David Warren. ["Apologize for What?"] [http://www.davidwarrenonline.com/index.php?artID=649] I especially like: "The manufacture of grievances, Militant Islam is an existential threat to civilization, just as a pack of crocodiles is an existential threat to a riverside community. Feeding crocodiles, as Churchill pointed out, does not make crocodiles less dangerous. Militant Islam is making pitiless war against civilization -- including civilized Muslims. Churchill (again) has eloquently stated the only safe policy: "You ask, What is our policy? I You ask, What is our aim? I can gm :I agree with Pamela. Ratzinger included the statement about the inclusion of evil in Islam to ensure that his message about the Godliness of Reason was publicized. The message being - conversion by the sword is not God's will. I think he was also announcing that resistance from the church will begin if dialogue is not forthcoming. Mike H. :Sir, the silence is partly due to the fact that there are a number of us out here who can handle a rifle much better than a pen. Pete :My list of brave (and wise) writers is short too... with just a few names more than your list, including yours. Yes, these are grim times. But thank you, VDH. You give us strength. mahmoud :By taking personal responsibility for the reaction to his truthful message, Benedict XVI did something so very typically Christian - he accepted blame for the sins of the Muslims. Tom Wall :VDH certainly belongs to that short list of clear eyed writers. Some good may come from the furor re: Pope's message. I think perhaps this last bit of Muslim rage will open the door for some to see the truth. It's there right in front of their faces. The biggest problem is that the people don't apologize but the media is willingly doing it for us. owlbear1 :Watching tens of thousands of their fellow believers slaughtered for the fancy of prig white boys has that affect on a Religion.
Brian Howell :I, too, was very disappointed to read of the Pope's apology for speaking the truth. Thank you for highlighting Ms. Fallaci's example! May God grant us brave souls who will speak the truth without fear and who will reach out to Muslim neighbors and co-workers in the West on a personal level. Face to face dialogue and a true meeting of the minds will be necessary to combat the violent proclamations spewing forth from too many Muslim leaders today. Tennwriter :Professor Hanson, I am a neocon, I became one after 9/11 and Bush pointed out as did others, the danger of rogue states, WMD, and terrorists. I remain one. The logic is inescapable. Even if I wanted to, I could not surrender for surrender would be pointless. Or as Sun Tzu said--'on death ground, fight'. I am commanded to stand firm for the divinity of Christ, and against all false prophets. I am also an American born free with multitudes of liberties ranging from soul liberty to freedom of speech. I cannot in good conscience give these gifts up. There is no man on Earth with the right to demand such from me. Instead I say with the two spies who went into Canaan, indeed there are giants in the land, but so are there great rewards, and God is bigger than the giants that face us. There are hundreds of thousands of pschyotics in the Middle East, but then there are tens of millions of souls longing to be free to meet God and man without a dictatorial religion that murders apostates and women who show an ankle, and crude thugs who murder for simple power and pleasure. In the darkness of the valley of the present moment, when fair-weather friends desert remember, the God of George Washington, Abraham Lincoln, and George Bush II is greater than the giants in the land. Out of the twelve spies who went into the land, a full ten said it could not be done. They were wrong. Their spiritual descendants are wrong today as well. denny flood :"Christians of influence"? I'm not sure exactly what those are. The Pope is one, clearly, and God bless him for his courage. From inside the Evangelical ghetto, however, it looks like our leaders are absent on the whole issue of modern Islam. Maybe not absent. Maybe just so concerned with being politically correct, and justifying that stance by appealing to notions of the Kingdom of God and its transendence, that they can't engage the reality of earth and blood. Islam cannont long coexist with any religion other than itself, that does not deny itself by submitting to Islam. Islam, if true to its pseudoprophet's bandit roots, must ascend by force. It would seem that Islam will NEVER reinvent itself. Its system of thought and practice seems to render a sufficient number of its adherents constitutionally incapable of the sort of reflection necessary for that. In the world of earth and blood, exterminative war against, or submission to, Islam will prove to be the only real options. War not to make converts, but to overcome a great evil, and to survive. Or submission, dhimmitude not by conviction, but by cowardice. Our deeds will tell which of those we prefer. LewH :It was probably good that Orian Fallaci died before Pope Benedict XVI made his apology. It may have reuined whatever little faith she had left in christianity and would have destroyed her. As seen, apologys do not prevent the agents of doom and sould not be uttered in the hope that the apology will prevent slaughter. Any sign of human values is treaterd as weakness by Islamic terrorists. gs :My previous comment (Sep 17, 2006 06:28 AM) was overly optimistic. Today's Vatican press releases are here. The Vatican Secretary of State's statement is here , and the pope's is here. ("...I am deeply sorry for the reactions in some countries to a few passages of my address at the University of Regensburg, which were considered offensive to the sensibility of Muslims. These in fact were a quotation from a medieval text, which do not in any way express my personal thought.") I wish he had said that the reactions had deepened his concern. It would have been better to keep silent than to speak out and back down. One misstep does not a papacy unmake, but was this a tactical slip or does it signal a deeper deficiency in Ratzinger's leadership? Time will tell. Bruce W. :
I trust his will and energies will battle back to the Front, where he will continue to give us all a voice, and a reason to continue having hope and strength. Although I identify myself as a "Neo-Con" (reborn as one just over 5 yrs ago), I have never completely taken to the name because this movement, this belief system, is not "Neo-" anything, but instead the most important force in existence today for the salvation of Western Civilization. It is based on the simple truths that our civilzation is worth saving and that our enemies are commited to destroying it and us. Everything else is noise. Fight on, VDH. Continue to make us proud and strong.
igout :Cheer up, VDH. Don't you find these times even a wee bit exciting? Would you really want to go back to the age of Clinton: fat, dumb and happy? Retief :What?!? What kind of Christian is this who tells us that the souls of confirmed atheists get eternally saved? Because God likes her politics? That don't make no sense. B. Beyamenu :9/11 has come and gone, butthe question still stands:Who benefits from Terrorism? It’s obvious that nothing much will change until the World's perspective on the problem changes.We'll never get back to the civilized world (peaceful intercourse, developing economies, flourishing airlines and ever increasing international tourism)we all remember so fondly, until those who benefit from Terrorism are incapacitated.As you well know it's neither the Palestinians/Iraqis, Afghans nor the Lebanese who benefit from Terrorist activities.What is going on is not hatred of Moslems for Jews/Americans/Israelis and vice versa. People don't hate people. All people have the same aspirations - peace, a roof over their head and food on the table.It is uninspired Leaders who, because of their agenda, indoctrinate people with hatred for their fellowmen.The Despots of the Middle East, abetted by the Fundamentalist Imams, who finance the teaching of hatred in the Mosque and the Madrass and the training and arming Of deluded Youth (whom they disfranchise, exploit and intimidate), are intent on sacrificing the last Palestinian "Freedom Fighter" and the last Iraqi "Paradise Seeker" to ensure the perpetuation of their own regimes.This is a battle of Despots against Democracy that commenced with the appearance of Israel's fledgling Democracy in the Middle East.Expose the Despots and their heinous exploitation of their own subjects and curtail their financing of Terrorism and you bring an end to a sad chapter in World History. drydock :Hitchens said Fallaci is an example of how not to write about Islam. While her earlier years may be something to admire, Hitchens knows her later writings were filled with inflamantory racism. But I guess that's what the posters here admire-- she said what they don't have the balls to say. syn :I'm wondering if Hitchens can explain how one can be racist when speaking of religion. If criticism made a religion constitutes racism then those who have been flaming Christian/Judeo religion have a lot of apologising for their racist and inflamantory remarks. stu williamson :The Pope did not "blunder". He knew exactly what he was saying - had given it intensive thought and had it vetted by Vatican press and public relations specialists. His response was just as asurely carefully scripted ahead of time. He did not apologize: he simpy said he was "sorry for the reactions", even though he most assuredly expected them. He did not say "I should not have used that quotation." He said that it did not express his personal thoughts, but gave no clue as to what those present thoughts might be. He delivered a clear message, and got the response he anticipated, from people who got his message. This Pope is a wise statesman, who is unafraid to make clear his position without using overtly challenging language. "I am sorry if I upset you." Too bad that we have no leaders as forthright - except in Australia. gs :Today's Vatican press releases do not encourage me. Ratzinger said ...I quoted some words from a Christian-Muslim dialogue from the 14th century in which the Christian - the Byzantine Emperor Manuel II Paleologus - presented to his Muslim interlocutor, in a manner we find incomprehensibly brusque, the problem of the relationship between faith and violence.So the emperor was "incomprehensibly brusque" during a "Christian-Muslim dialogue" which took place...a few years before 1453? In contrast, the Vatican Secretary Secretary of State's telegram of condolence might be viewed as papal brusqueness toward his own people--but definitely not toward Islam. From Cardinal Paul Poupard, president of the Pontifical Council for Inter-religious Dialogue: ...The alternative route to terrorism and violence is dialogue, and this involves the recognition of differences.Two comments. First, to talk about 'dialogue' when presented with violence, rage and intimidation is not necessarily an 'alternative route to terrorism and violence'; on the contrary, it could well be the royal road to the unwanted destination. Second, the enemy has no difficulty whatever about "recognition of differences"; the deliberate blindness lies on our side. I've quickly developed concerns about the pope: his age, his background, and perhaps his ethnicity. Age: even given an ascetic lifestyle, 79 is an advanced age for steering a global institution through major turbulence. Background: Ratzinger's academic and theological roots may leave him ill-prepared to deal with Islamists' posturing emotionalism and cynical propagandizing. Ethnicity: surely the time is long past for civlization's spokesmen to express an element of righteous anger, but is the West yet ready to listen to righteous, even martial, anger in a German accent? (Initially I wondered if Ratzinger was hinting that the Germans could do penance for the Holocaust by leading Europe's defense against Islamism.) Mister Ghost :Thanks to VDH for his nice thoughts on Oriana Fallaci. I included it my tribute: Monkeytango :Although not a Catholic, I support the Pope to the hilt. He's not stupid and must have had at least some awareness of the Islamic hornet's nest that his comments would stir up. As well as shining a light on the Muslim world (with none too-flattering results) the over-reaction led bemused onlookers such as myself to check the historical facts he was referring to. Although most people in the UK (where I am) remain silent in the face of a craven, garbage-spewing media, there's certainly been a subtle shift in terms of public feelings towards Islam. Those old arguments about 'it's only a minority of trouble-makers', or 'we need more dialogue wih them' seem less convincing by the day (witness that grotesque protest outside Westminster Cathedral a few days ago). Although England is yet to wake from its collective stupor, at least some of us have realised what's happened to this country. Whether the West has the backbone to fight for our civilisation is another matter... Dave Begley - Omaha :Another view on the Pope and worth reading. Dan Henninger in the WSJ. Link below. His point: The Pope is serious about talks between Muslims and Christians about stopping all this nutty violence. Faith and reason. Comments have been archived for this page. |
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Both Falluci and Ratzinger (aka benedictXVI) know history, and see the threat of Islamic expansion into Europe.
But most of Ratz'talk was about the rejection of Greek logic and reason by modern relativism...check out the whole thing...
Sep 16, 2006 07:26 PM